Posted by They say a picture says a thousand words. In that case here are 3000 words.
Cute girl though. She almost masks the globs of burgundy seats behind her. Almost.
I couldn’t help but react to a blindly written article in USA Today a few days ago. Kevin Allen writes with the optimism reminiscent of one of Gary Bettman’s State Of The League addresses. What he fails to discuss is the true dire straits the Phoenix Coyotes are in right now, and have been in for some time. In fact they were doomed from the day they left Maroons Road at Polo Park in city that now lets the Vancouver Canucks farm club call home. Granted, things weren’t all that great when they left Winnipeg, but it had nothing to do with the fans or corporate support. Never did.
The pictures above, taken this season at a Saturday night game no less, tell a different story. So do the books in the ‘Yotes offices. And they are very closely correlated. No fans equals no revenues. In fact quite the opposite. In the 13 seasons being in the desert, the Coyotes have endured multiple owners and over a half billion dollars in losses, including over $30 million this year, prompting league life support to keep them above water. No pun intended. These are levels unimaginable if the team were to still reside in Manitoba’s capital. Yes, Winnipeg is always deemed a small market. But that is population wise. What about hockey fan wise? What does raw population have to do with selling hockey tickets? All that matters to the NHL, or all that should matter, is how many hockey fans there are in a market, not people. Under that mentality, why not put a team in Sydney or Hong Kong? Oh boy, I better not give Gary any ideas. And you can’t say the reason is TV revenue because anyone in the US that tries to find NHL hockey on TV will bellow a collective laugh at that reasoning.
Winnipeg has more hockey fans per capita than possibly any market in North America and no other sport that ranks above it to compete with. No NFL, MLB, NBA, NASCAR or any number of NCAA teams. Nope, hockey is front page news in Winnipeg, even the AHL’s Manitoba Moose, who by the way draw 6,000-8,000 fans on a regular basis. For those of you wondering, that’s roughly how many paying customers the Coyotes are drawing when you subtract how many tickets are freebies or discount tickets. And as for actual attendances, the photos above were from a game on Saturday, November 1st against the Wild. These are not pre-game photos but rather during play. They announced a crowd of 14,817. Now look at the photos again. Now 14,817 wouldn’t be great, especially for a Saturday night anyway, but the actual attendance is clearly more in the range of 9,000-10,000. Wouldn’t want to see a Tuesday night.
Now I’m not attacking Phoenix for any particular reason other than they are on the radar to relocate at some point and that interests many peolpe where I come from. The reality is that 6 or 7 teams are in similar dismal situations. Namely Nashville, Atlanta, Miami, Tampa, Columbus, Raleigh and even the New York Islanders. Although their issues are unique in themselves, they still pose the questions: has the NHL finally come to terms that the sun belt experiment has failed miserably and if so, how do they intend to fix it?
It’s not easy by any stretch of the imagination.
Lets go back to Phoenix. They cannot simply pack up and move to the highest bidder. They have a building that was constructed almost entirely contingent on the existence of the Coyotes as the NBA Suns still play out of US Airways Center. There are rumoured penalties of in excess of $700 million to bail out of Phoenix. The only option is Chapter 11, the most dreaded term in any entrepreneur’s vocabulary.
But what is the alternative, really? I’m sure to get hate mail, but there is no long-term hope in Arizona for NHL hockey. They are currently ranked dead last in value by Forbes magazine, they have crowds like the ones seen above on a Saturday night, and they can’t ice a good hockey team. Ironic how many times Wayne Gretzky used to beat up on the Jets through the 1980’s only to possibly end up sinking with a ship called Jobing.com Arena. I’m in Arizona frequently. Phoenix included. I know the announced attendance vs. the real attendance. I know the atmosphere. I know the media coverage. In Phoenix it’s all about the Cardinals, and until this year they’ve been dreadful. In Tucson it’s all about Lute Olsen and the Wildcats.
Kevin Allen may want to see things with rose coloured glasses but some of his main points for why there is no reason for concern in Phoenix are ill-founded. Firstly, Gary Bettman saying the league has no plans to contract or relocate any franchise is like believing Pacman Jones doesn’t plan to go to a niteclub ever again. Secondly, some added parking revenue is not going to turn the buckets of red ink into black ink. Thirdly, yes Pittsburgh, Buffalo and Ottawa received financial assistance but they all have something in common. They are all established hockey markets with a proven track record…and…well…snow!
If moving a franchise is Gary Bettman’s last resort, well then that time has come, or at the very least is right over the horizon.
Winnipeg will regain an NHL franchise. I don’t know if it will be Phoenix, in fact likely not as that would be far too embarrassing for Gary Bettman to handle. Afterall, where was the life support for the Jets in 1995? But the inevitable is coming and no matter how much Kevin Allen or anyone else wants to think some parking revenue will save the day….it won’t. Sad actually, for the fans that do exist in Phoenix. Believe me, up here we know the feeling.
(photos courtesy of Alex Snell)
In Winnipeg...
Darren Ford
Founder
Return of the Jets Campaign
www.JetsOwner.com
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Phoenix Coyotes
Coyotes Snap Losing Streak: Look To Get on a Roll Against Canucks
Coyotes Return Home for Showdown with Red Wings
Coyotes Become Chum: Lose 2-0 and Reinprecht
Shark Bait? Coyotes Head Into Shark Tank
Coyotes Go From the Frying Pan into the Flames
We hope you enjoyed this post. As always, leaving a comment below is both appreciated and encouraged. Thanks!
You’ll hear all kinds of excuses from Coyote fans….. “The arena is in Glendale; the location sucks” (yet their NFL team is in the same location and fans don’t seem to have a problem going to Cardinal games)…. “the team isn’t that good”….. “i’ll go to a few games- but only after the NFL season is over”….. “beer is $7.00″… etc.
If today Winnipeg had our own NHL team, Jobing.com Arena (a facility that honestly looks twice as nice as MTS Centre- and ZERO obstructed view seats might I add- nothing like the Winnipeg Arena) on the outskirts of the city (lousy location), WAYNE GRETZKY at every game, and the same ticket prices the Coyotes charge, people would be killing each other for tickets….
I could never understand the giving away of tickets to fill an arena until I read the report last week that a team must have a certain percentage of seats filled to get the team’s share of revenue sharing. I have a feeling giveaways are epidemic in many US cities for this reason. Give away $1 million in tickets to receive $5 million. Make good business sense, and Phoenix (and others) still can’t pull it off.
Unfortunately, Phoenix is a very fair weather city when it comes to sports. Even now the Coyotes are in a good spot in the standings and yet they can’t get people to go. All those things the anonymous poster has put down are all excuses that the people of Phoenix use to excuse themselves from these games and it is unfortunate. One thing is certain though, the franchise will not move as long as the lease deal doesn’t change. Unfortunately for Winnipeg, I don’t think the NHL has the city very high on its list in terms of places to move an NHL team. I would love to see a team there again but I don’t think it is a realistic possibility right now.
@Chris, by ‘anonymous poster’ I think you mean anonymous commentator as the poster would be Darren (writer’s name appear at the bootom of the post). I wasn’t sure if I should allow anonymous comments but it seemed relevant to the story. I’d have to disagree about the NHL’s stance on Winnipeg though, I think it has improved it’s standing quite a bit as the US economic realities will force some cities to disengage from expansion or relocation talks. Canada hasn’t been hit nearly as hard and both Winnipeg and Hamilton are NUTS about hockey.
Lots of issues with moving back to Winnipeg I assume. Number one is the Coyotes owners own the rink in Glendale. So sure they lose money on the team but they must make some of the money back from food and booze and merchandise and parking etc. Not sure that would amount to half a a billion dollars. That is an amazing amount of money to lose in 13 years for ANY type of business.
Hamilton – Portand – Kansas City – Oklahoma City – and of course Winnipeg really are the only options – maybe even Halifax if they had a better rink.
Within 24 months things will change and perhaps the once proud Blue – Red and White Jet colors will fly again in Winnipeg.
I dont know if anyone has said this because I dont read forums at all, im not a fan but Im from wpg I know this issue well, I felt like commenting.
This article makes excellent points no doubt. Great read I’d recommend it. To the writer however, the main reason why Winnipeg isn’t supporting a franchise is based on population. Sure it’s a great hockey town but it doesn’t generate enough dollars which is the real concern for professional sports these days. Quick question for NHL A) Sell out an arena of 10-12,000 ppl in winnipeg or B) Sell out (roughly) 15,000 + ppl in Phoenix….seems easy answer to me….
The real problem is they aren’t marketing the sport right in Phoenix, and it is a hard job. If they can create a big enough buzz and reach a serious fan base in Phoenix then it was a success. The NHL knows they can sell out in WPG but big deal when the arena is only gonna seat 8, 000. Does this mean much because I’m tired of writing haha…
guy, what are you talking about..the MTS centre seats 15000, not 8000..8000 is a good day for the coyotes in terms of attendance..now i agree that the money just wont be there, but the reasons you are giving are laughable..the problem with winnipeg is that nobody will swallow their pride and court an eager american owner..instead people here just sit around waiting to see if the aspers or some local ownership group will step up and put forth the money to get it done..the aspers are tied up in trying to get the bombers, and nobody else has expressed interest in funding anything..buck up, give mark cuban or somebody down south with a fat wallet and the eagerness to potentially turn some profit, and you would likely get something done with the league within 3 years
i agree with c o.
9000- 10,000 fans at the above game ? Not a chance !!! According to the above pictures, there can’t be more than 5000 people there. What does the place hold? 20,000 ? If it does in fact hold 20,000 there is no way there are more than 5000 people there.
Why don’t we try it, let the coyotes play their remaining home games at the MTS Centre in Winnipeg. Would be tough working around the Moose schedule, but maybe the Moose could play the odd conflicting game out of Brandon. I would be shocked if they didn’t sell out every remaining home game 15,015. Of course the majority of revenue would be going to the current yotes owner to cover current expenses/portion of debt and perhaps added costs such as penalties from to trying to pull this off. It would however prove what most of us already know that Winnipeg should get another shot.
This article is a good read, but I think a few things should be pointed out. “Granted, things weren’t all that great when they left Winnipeg, but it had nothing to do with the fans or corporate support. Never did.” This statement isn’t exactly accurate. Yes, the hockey fans are there, but we’re forgetting how easy it was to get a ticket in Winnipeg in the 90s. Lots of games with a few thousand empty seats. And, of course, Winnipeg does have some corporate support, but it’s not about having “some” corporate support. It’s about having a lot of corporate support. The NHL knows exactly what having a team in Winnipeg means. It means having good passionate fans, even more passionate I’m sure when the team is winning (which we never got to experience), and it also means having full corporate support from a very small corporate base. The potential in Phoenix, the fastest growing North American city, is what makes the NHL salivate.
Now, what the NHL needs to do is to get back to what it really is. A northern North American “big-league.” Gary Bettman’s strategy made sense to a lot of NHL owners in the early 90s, the southern sunbelt was growing and the traditional stronghold of capital in the northeast was slowly dying. So, put teams in areas of growth, ie. the south. However, as we have all seen over the past 15 years, hockey doesn’t work in the south. Fire Bettman and his southern strategy, re-brand the NHL as the northern “big-league” sport, put a few more teams in Canada, and for god sakes give Hartford back their team, and get on with making sound profits again.
O.K…………..the place holds 17,799 for hockey. Not a chance there are more than 5000 at this game. According to the pictures I don’t understand how the above article can suggest there are 9000-10,000 people in the building……………there may not be 5,000 in the stands.
I want the jets back as much as anyone out there, but honestly, they would also bleed here, just at a much slower rate. We would have great support for a year, perhaps two, but it would be next to impossible to find 7000 season ticket holders at an average of 3500$ per ticket, and who would want to go by themselves! So, lets say 7000$ per year on tickets, not to mention food, parking, merchandise…. that is roughly 15% of the average family income in Winnipeg. We need long term support (more than 5 years) and a guarantee of that. We would lose money, just like Pheonix, but would never be allowed to reach 500 million in the red. And who in Winnipeg during these tough financial times would step up and buy them?
J.D., first of all the dollar sign goes BEFORE the number (ex. $7000), not AFTER it.
Secondly, Edmonton and Ottawa sell out every game and I don’t hear people from those cities complaining about ticket prices. And it costs a lot more to live in Ontario and Alberta than it does in Manitoba.
Thirdly, the people that complain about NHL ticket prices are not the type of people that go to NHL hockey games, making your whole “argument” against a team coming to Winnipeg moot and irrelevant.
I’m having a hard time understanding what J.D. is talking about when he throws out a number like 7000 season ticket holders or $7,000 per season ticket package. Firstly 7,000 season ticket packages is only (roughly) 47% of what the MTS Centre holds (15,015). I feel that that number only underestimates the full potential of Winnipeg and surrounding communities. I think that season ticket holder number could be a lot higher. Secondly season ticket packages would not be that high, even for the best seat in the house. According to an estimation on jetsowner.com, the highest full season ticket package would only cost $4,620 and the least expensive full season ticket package would cost $1,496. Here is a link to these numbers: http://www.jetsowner.com/howmuch.htm
Really, does it matter how much tickets are? I think it’s a non-issue. If you can’t afford it, stay home. Simple. Watch it on tv. Listen on the radio. Order the webcast.
We have a 15,000 seat arena and a city of, oh, about 200,000 hockey fans- most of whom are die-hards.
I think filling up the MTS Centre 45 nights a year for NHL hockey is the least of our worries.
I agree…finding a team that Bettman will allow to relocate is definitely a bigger worry.
I have a few rebuttals to some of the points raised.
1) Corporate support in Winnipeg would be questionable.
True, Winnipeg wouldn’t be a Montreal, Toronto or even Calgary, but they’d do just fine. A vast majority of the high priced advertising would be covered by big-time national or international companies (Coke, Nike, GM etc). Winnipeg has a large enough corporate community to cover the few remaining advertising spots as well as a good number of season tickets. Business in Winnipeg is in much better shape today that it has been in a long time and the outlook is bright.
2) The Jets attendance was mediocre at best the first time around.
The Jets averaged around 13,500 people per game in their final three season (omitting the final, lame-duck season). By todays standards, not great (albeit still better than some of the struggling teams). However, if you look back at the records, the Jets were averaging 13,500ish in a time when the average attendance in the NHL was slightly over 14,000. Now take into consideration that during this time, many of the teams that are failing now did not exist. If you eliminate Atlanta, Nashville, Phoenix, Carolina and Columbus from the current picture, the NHL’s average attendance goes from around 16,500 to nearly 18,000. So what does all of this say? Well, basically, at the time, the Jets were averaging about 500 people less than the teams that are currently averaging around 18,000 (ie,the teams near the top of the attendance rankings). No reason to think the situation wouldn’t be similar now. If the demand for NHL in Winnipeg has increased at the same rate as the other cities that had NHL team in the early 90’s, they’d be able to draw more people than the MTS Centre can hold.
3) The situation in Winnipeg wouldn’t be much better than these struggling cities
I fail to see how anyone can think this. Even if an NHL team in Winnipeg doesn’t do great on the ice, they will still come close to filling the MTS Centre every night. Like I mentioned in my previous point, in theory, the demand for a team could/should exceed building capacity. So lets say there’s 14,000-15,000 people per game for an NHL team in the MTS Centre. That’s looking better than 13,000 tickets distributed, maybe 10,000 in the building and maybe 7,000 of them having paid full price, like it is in some other markets. And lets not forget merchandise. I don’t see the crowds in Arizona and Florida all decked out in jerseys, hats and whatnot. The Jets have been gone for 15 years and their jerseys still sell like crazy. You should see some of the Jets merch they still make. Bar stools, hot tubs, you name it. Why? Because there’s still a market, even with no team. All of that crap that has a Jets logo on it is potential revenue for a team here.
Interesting to consider what has happened to most of the other cities that have been given a second chance of having an NHL team. At one point, teams in Minneapolis, Atlanta, Colorado and Ottawa all failed for one reason or another. However, NHL hockey is now thriving again in those centers (with the exception of Atlanta perhaps, but at least they got a second chance) due mostly because of new arenas that were better suited to generate revenue in today’s NHL. The Jets failed in 1996 arguably because Winnipeg Arena was inadequate. I know it doesn’t all come down to having a new arena, but it seems to go a long way. It would be interesting to know what else happened in those other cities to get the NHL to consider them viable again. I would bet that Winnipeg has had the same things happen in the last 13 years….
I see the picture but it does not show the time of the game. Show a picture of a game with 10 minutes left in the 2nd period and clearly show the scoreboard. Even a Detroit and Toronto game are empty in the first 2 minutes. That said, no excuses for the Yotes and their fans.
Looks like Mr. Ford is new to this site. But in typical Darren Ford writing, he talks trash about other markets but leaves out anything about Winnipeg business support, or that Asper, the new proposed Jets owner is wrapped up in the Blue Bombers new stadium deal for a $100M and that his wealth is dissipating faster than Snow in the desert due to his newspaper business. Or that Mark Chipman makes enough off the Moose and does not come close to the wealth needed to be an NHL owner. Or who are the others in this secretive ownership group. (do they really exist?) Or that even Chipman has said that costs of new teams are too high for the Peg and it has been said by Asper or Chipman that $40M payroll is too high cost for a team in Winnipeg. No mention either the Corporate situation of finding constant owners of the 48 suites at a minimal $200K CND a year year on year on long term leases and they will renew as costs go up in the next 10 to 15 years.
I went to a game on a Saturday night in PHX and there were around 16K fans there. Real fans in real seats. It did not look even close to the game above.
I hope Winnipeg gets a team but instead of trashing other markets, how about some clear definition of how a team in Winnipeg will generate $75M–$85M USD worth of revenue today and even more in the years to come..
Until then, a team in Winnipeg is a pipe dream.
Well someone obviously didn’t check out JetsOwner.com where it extensively lays out just how Winnipeg would generate $80 million, right down to the last penny.
Please do YOUR research before accusing me of not doing mine. I’ve lived this cause for 6 years, there is nothing I can’t back up. In additon, what I decide to write is what I decide to write. If someone wants to write a rebuttal I welcome it, but just know I have an answer to anything you can throw at me. That’s not to say Winnipeg is a flawless market, but it is better than half the teams in the NHL today. Period.
OH HappyCanuck….you have problems.
CLEARLY, there is a time posted on the clock. If you want to see other pictures from that game, visit Jetsowner.com and post a question in the “Off-Topic” section and i’ll provide them to you.
As far as bashing Darren; Leave the guy alone! He’s done MORE than anyone has to ensure Hockey Fans all around the world are up to date on Winnipeg’s current situation in obtaining another franchise & provided all the believers out there a amazing website which PROVES Winnipeg can support an NHL Franchise & Be one of the more successful at it!
Second; As Darren has pointed out; Research would do you good. Please view the following to help you understand Mark Chipman’s role: http://ca.youtube.com/watch?v=zu6uAuTXBOo
In the future, before coming on here and posting such nonsense, do what has been suggested to you as far as research goes, and next time you won’t come off as such an ignorant person.
Here’s a thought: Edmonton Oilers season seats currently go for $1255 to $6787/seat. Single game retail seats go for $41.50 to $224.00. Calgary Flames season seats currently go for $1385 to $7093/seat. Single game retail seats go for $19.00 to $228.00 Conduct a poll in Winnipeg and the surrounding areas through popular media outlets (Free Press, Sun, radio station websites, etc., perhaps even CJOB…) to see how many people would actually buy season tickets or single game tickets at or around those prices. Might not be 100% accurate, but at least it would give a good indication of the actual fan base that would truly support an NHL team. If the media angle is too skewed a route to go down, then do it through a professional polling organization. Don’t get me wrong, I’m the biggest advocate (ok, besides Darren…) for getting the Jets back but I think it would be prudent, useful and quite interesting to stop the guessing and positing about whether or not Winnipeg would support a team again. There’s no question Winnipeg loved (and still loves) the Jets. It would be nice to know for sure though if the fans would really be up for supporting the team at today’s prices otherwise we may all just be wasting our time and energy. If this or something like it has been done recently, then I would love to be enlightened!
I don’t hear hockey fans in Calgary and Edmonton whining about ticket prices… and they sell out every game… AND it costs a lot more to live in Alberta than it does in Manitoba too.
Selling tickets for Winnipeg NHL games and corporate support WILL NOT be a problem. I’m absolutely sure of that.
The only thing I’m concerned about is waiting for a current NHL team to go up for sale. Some have been failing for years. Florida, for example, has been a disaster since the mid 90’s for God’s sake. What’s taking these teams so long to relocate?
And if the owners do decide to put the team up for sale, who’s to say there aren’t people out there who wouldn’t mind losing millions and keeping the teams in their current location?
I agree 100% with the fact Alberta sells out their games. I don’t get where the small price tag for the cheapest season tickets comes from? The cheapest in Calgary is almost double that. And for 4620$ price for season tickets, that is about 100$ per game, and the last year when I went to Calgary 100$ got me pretty average seats. It is more than 160$ for the best seats per game and the sitting in the far back are still 30$ per game. So where do you get your numbers from? So the range in season ticket prices is actually 7000$ (as I said already) down to the mentioned 1500$. I don’t understand how we can support a team financially like Calgary if, for starters our arena is already smaller than theirs, and secondly, charge less for tickets.
My understanding was that Winnipeg never had more than 6000 season tickets sold in any one year. So, 7000 seemed like a reachable number for Winnipeggers to sell. I want a team here, but don’t want to go through losing one again.
And Hockey Fan, the $ sign is after money in proper British grammer. Check it out before making a comment about it!
JD- the dollar sign ($) is supposed to come BEFORE the number
Winnipeg will need about 12,500 – 13,000 season ticket holders. And I’ve no doubts we’ll reach that goal quickly.
It’s not 1990 anymore and we’re not playing at a Winnipeg Enterprises-controlled Winnipeg Arena with 5,000 obstructed-view seats.
I think the Minnesota North Stars only had about 5,500 season ticket holders, at least in the late 80s. The Minnesota WILD have 16,000 season ticket holders- and a 5 year waiting list.
Time…. a new, modern facility.. and 1st class ownership make ALL the difference in the world!
A couple people pointed out that Winnipeg “only” averaged 13,500 fans per game. Considering the Jets never advanced past the second round of the playoffs and the fact that they played in and old, outdated, Winnipeg Enterprises-controlled arena, I think that number is remarkable.
Today Winnipeg has a brand new world-class facility with all the comforts and amenities that go along with it. I think having a venue like this watch a game will make a tremendous difference.
I think it should also be pointed out that unlike most other markets, Winnipeggers know what it’s like to lose an NHL franchise. I think the fans will really appreciate and embrace the return of the Jets, and will NOT take them for granted.
I think you’ll see a much different scenario the next time around.
Mr.Ford…………….please reply.
I am a die hard Jets fan…………die hard for about 30 years. I have been following Jetsowner.com for about 6 years, and have agreed with almost everything you have posted.
The above article states that there are aprox 9000-10,000 people in the building. This suggestion has me confused. If you look at the pictures you can clearly conclude….. when looking at all three pictures, the differant sections are aprox 25% to 33 % full…..I would suggest that this is generous. Using 25%-33% as an average, you could in fact conclude that on average all sections are aprox 29 % full. The building holds 17,799 for hockey…….correct me if I am wrong. 17,799 * 29% = 5,161.
Again, keep in mind that 29 % according to all pictures is probably a generous number. You have looked at these pictures and over estimated by aprox 5000 or 50 % of the actual people in the building. Again, I usually agree with you. However this statement has me concerned because you are so far off. I can only hope that when looking at facts you are not so far off with some of your more important numbers.
You stated above that “there is nothing I can’t back up” Please back up the comment of 9000-10,000 people at this game. Again, keep in mind that I believe in bringing the Jets back to Winnipeg, and I also believe that it can work.
J.D. & Hockey Fan – I got the ticket prices from each team’s official NHL website. Feel free to verify. I actually live in Calgary now (left Wpg a year after the Jets did) and I’m a Flames season ticket holder (though still a Jets fan at heart). You’re right in that no one complains about the ticket prices here. We likely have some of the cheapest tickets in the league here. In fact, there is a 5000 person waiting list just for the chance at season tickets. Yes, it costs more to live in Alberta, but the average family wage is also much higher. I’m just saying that if Winnipeg is to get a team back, fans will have to be prepared to dish out close to what we do in Calgary and Edmonton. I’d like to see hard facts via some kind of poll showing the number of people who would be prepared and willing to pay that kind of money. Believe me, nothing would please me more than to see a poll showing 25000 people willing to get in line for season tickets averaging $3-4000. That’s the purpose of my initial comment – I just want to see how many people will step up!
JB
As much as I would love to agree that there are 5,000 people there, and some nights this may very well be true, I cannot exaggerate the situation the night these photos were taken. Your math would prove correct if all sections were at “25-30%” full. However, if you look closely you’ll notice the upper decks are much fuller between the goals lines. This would significantly increase the overall percentage of seats full per section. Of course my estimation was just that, an estimation. Frankly I don’t see why this has created so much hype. It was just a rough guess at the crowd that night. The actual number really has no bearing because whether it’s 5,000 or 9,000…it’s all bad. Lets go with 8,000 and call it even!
Well if teams like the Coyotes get only 8,000 attending fans (and who knows how many of those people actually PAID MONEY for their ticket), then why are there so many ignorant people out there who think MTS Centre is too small to support an NHL team?
Good article. Two points I have: first, Phoenix is actually having quite a decent team this season and I wouldn’t be too surprised if they make the playoffs this year. Second, if the team moves to Winnipeg, are you sure there are enough free agents that would be interested in coming to and living in Winnipeg? As far as I remember this was their problem in the late 80’s and early 90’s and I’m not sure if today’s millionaires who live in Scottsdale, AZ, play golf every weekend and have large pools and jacuzzis in their 5-acre backyards would be too excited to move to Manitoba. Remember, it never freezes in Arizona. Shane Doan sticks to this team because the quality of living in AZ.
hey everyone…
wow…this is definately a powerful article…certainly is drawing alot of attention
i live in canada and i am a big coyotes fan..i have ever since the team left winnipeg because i was a jets fan growing up..i lived in winnipeg at the time and attended about a dozen jets games during my time living there…
but then i moved down to southern ontario..and…it just so happened..that the jets folded a year later..in 1996..then they moved to phoenix and..well..i became a fan of them …and i still am to this day..
but i became a bigger fan the day that wayne gretzky was brought in the franchise…gretzky was my idol growing up..so by him coming to the organization my love for phoenix became stronger…
i know people criticize him as a coach ..and ive heard some people say he would be much better as the gm..but still…you have to love him for what he brought to the game of hockey and the many years he entertained hockey fans for so many years…and how he was idolized by lots of people like myself..so what if hes cocky behind the bench..hes still the same old wayne..lol..only with a beard..lol
so yeah..my point is ..i would hate to see this team relocate…sure i would be sad..but hey…you never know…i could just become a fan of the franchise to wherever they relocate to…
hey..it happened to me before..so it could certainly happen to me again..lol
on a quick note, just wanted to say i cant wait for the all star game this weekend..shane doan im sure will be outstanding
Thank you Ben for verifying the Calgary ticket prices. I got my numbers from the Calgary Flames website. I didn’t even go and check out Toronto because I know that there prices are alot higher! And didn’t know that Calgary actually below average ticket prices until you mentioned it! season tickets between 1500$-7000$ per year is alot of coin for the average person in Winnipeg. Sustainability is the key. Also, no one has mentioned who could step up and buy the team. Everyone has taken a bump with the current financial situation, even those that own the Moose. Lets keep our fingers crossed that a viable and sustainable solution can be reached.
Yes, the current economic downturn has had an interesting effect on the NHL. On one hand, it would seem that some of the struggling Sun Belt teams would be ripe for the picking. On the other hand, is there anyone in Winnipeg willing to step up and take a risk at this time to snatch up a team? It’s kind of a catch 22 situation. The saving grace may be that Canada in general is positioned much more favorably to come out of the recession with economic stability than the US is. I honestly think that the collapse and relocation of some of the US based teams is inevitable. There’s just no way that the league can be sustainable down there.
If it could be proven (which would be a requirement from the league anyway, of course) that a team would indeed work in the long term in Winnipeg then I think it’s a no-brainer to have a team there. In fact, if it did happen I would likely move back there and I’m sure I wouldn’t be the only one. The only condition I would need though is that the team be called the Jets again. Winnipeg is the Jets and I don’t think a team would work with any other name. Anyone else have thoughts on this?
Yes, I agree we keep the name, I’ll never forget watching them take to the ice and the anouncer saying, “YOUR WINNIPEG JETS!”, with the sound of the jet ripping by. Man, it still gives me goose bumps…
They used to come out onto the ice to Van Halen’s ‘Jump’. I used to think that was pretty cool. Of course, that was back when I thought acid washed jeans, the TV show ALF, and the k-car were great ideas too…
I don’t care if they’re called the “Jets” or not (and neither should anyone else). “Jets” really have relevance in Winnipeg… do we manufacture them? No. Do we have the busiest airport in Canada? No. Are we the main flying industry in Canada? No.
I say call the new team something new; something fresh. Something that says “Winnipeg” (or “Manitoba”).
Don’t foget that the exhibition game in Winnipeg this year generated over a million dollars in revenue. Withyonly twelve and a half thousand seats sold, give or take.If that average could be maintained it would have been good enough for eleventh overall in the NHL last year. The TV money for hockey is better in Winnipeg than most U.S. cities. Plus the merchandise sales are also higher. The MTS Centre, one of the busiest arenas in North America, would also be a huge revenue generator. Winnipeg will never rake in huge dollars like some of the larger Canadian cities, but if you’re a current NHL owner who still wants to own a team, but are tired of losing your shirt every year, Winnipeg looks pretty darn good.
As one of the many bitter Expos fan, I say go Jets go!
Your return site is an inspiration, and we are sure you will succeed.
best wishes,
GoSposII
A few of you people keep mentioning that it costs more to live in Alberta and Ontario and people don’t complain about the prices of tickets there. But that is simple. People make more money in these provinces. Heck, I moved to Alberta because I make double of what I’d make if I worked in my same field in Winnipeg. People don’t complain about the prices of tickets in these provinces because they make more money than people in Winnipeg. Look at the poverty in Winnipeg compared with other Canadian cities. Winnipeg is a shithole compared to cities like Calgary. As much as I’d love to see Winnipeg get an NHL team back, it will never happen. They won’t get the support they actually need for the long term, as much as one could say that they will. It won’t happen. Dream on. Just like Quebec City, it’ll never happen. But I must say the fans in the US suck ass. I went to visit my old team in Denver (I was a Nordiques fan since ‘86) last year and the fans were pathetic. I was definitely the loudest person there and people looked frightened of me when I was screaming in this one game when Ryan Smyth of the Avs got injured by some rookie from LA. Everyone around was like “oh, it’s because he’s Canadian.” Then they understood because I have passion for this game, unlike these lame Americans. Don’t get me wrong. There were some diehard fans there but when people show up to the game halfway through the 2nd period, that is lame.
Darren….your efforts on behalf of Winnipeg over the years have been admirable, and I am rooting for you here in Minnesota for Winnipeg’s success at this. Jets/Wild rivalry….bring it on!